Out of the Dumpster

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Easter
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#61

Post by Easter »

It is on the charger now (overnight) and I will check it in the morning but when I thought to check it, I was getting 12.75 then it dropped all the way to 4 something before I gave up.
Bikes at present:

83 XL 600r with a 2004 XR650L engine
And a slightly worse for the wear BMW GS adventure bike awaiting repair
83 GL in process :IDTS:
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Track T 2411
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#62

Post by Track T 2411 »

One simple test to eliminate the solenoid and/ or cable is to jump it directly from the battery to the starter terminal (or a screwdriver across the solenoid terminals, but that's kind of hard on the screwdriver...). Eliminating excessive resistance by pulling the plugs and turning it over can also give you an indication of the battery's condition.
"I have no special talent. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein

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Easter
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#63

Post by Easter »

Thanks Trck T, done both, several times. Just chasing my tail. After being on the charger overnight voltage is all the way up to 11.8. Turned the charger off and back on to start another cycle.
Bikes at present:

83 XL 600r with a 2004 XR650L engine
And a slightly worse for the wear BMW GS adventure bike awaiting repair
83 GL in process :IDTS:
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ericheath
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#64

Post by ericheath »

They are not supposed to be brought down to below?? 9 volts?? I left my ignition on once and it was down to 1+ volts. From what I'd read, a LIFEPO4 would be toast. I tried slow charge- not working. I then hooked it to a second battery and charged them together a while and it worked. Someone posted something about this a few years ago. Newer smart chargers need a certain amount of voltage reading to operate properly. Using the second battery fools the "smart" charger.
Whatever I suggest here should be given ample time for a moderator to delicately correct. I apologize in advance.
77 WING, 1200 engine with 77 heads, cams, gl1100 foot pegs, Magna V65 front end, 764A carbs, [-gone Suzuki M109 monoshock--, replaced with gl1100 shocks] gl 1200 swing arm, gl1500 final drive, wheel and rear brakes Valkyrie seat, Meanstreak tank, Sportster pipes, Power Arc ignition off crank.
77 Wing. black
83 Wing, in pieces
"Continuing education is important even if the subject matter is fairly useless (as in this case)."---Greg Foresi
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Easter
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#65

Post by Easter »

Checked it this morning, still less than 12 v. didn't get to mess with it today. Loading up for a trip to South Dakota. Taking the bikes with us so might get in some riding as well as family time. Be gone about 3 weeks. Did pick up my fenders from the sandblaster and got a coat of primer on them to hopefully avoid rust until I get back.
Bikes at present:

83 XL 600r with a 2004 XR650L engine
And a slightly worse for the wear BMW GS adventure bike awaiting repair
83 GL in process :IDTS:
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Easter
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#66

Post by Easter »

No progress to report as I have been out in the Black Hills riding my GL1800. Wonderful place to ride but wanted to be gone before the hoards arrive for the Sturgis Ralley.

Will get back to Goldie tomorrow hopefully. Might even get her to start! Fenders are back from sand blasting and ready for body work prior to paint. Still have some parts to order and the temp is scheduled to be around 100 degrees for the next couple months so things will be slow.
Bikes at present:

83 XL 600r with a 2004 XR650L engine
And a slightly worse for the wear BMW GS adventure bike awaiting repair
83 GL in process :IDTS:
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Easter
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#67

Post by Easter »

Messed with the bike a bit this evening, mounted a GL1100 throttle cable to the custom throttle grip. Just a bit long but seems OK. I am just using the pull cable.
Checked the resting voltage of the battery as it has been on the trickle charger for almost three weeks while I was on vacation. The battery registered 13.50 (or something close to that, can't remember for sure) and with one plug out it fired up momentarily when I first tried it. But that was all I could get out of it. Starter turns over too slow and gets hot. As I have tried several other starters i am not sure where to go with this.
Tomorrow I will recheck the timing and try a full size battery out of Dragon Wing and see if that makes any difference.
Bikes at present:

83 XL 600r with a 2004 XR650L engine
And a slightly worse for the wear BMW GS adventure bike awaiting repair
83 GL in process :IDTS:
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Easter
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#68

Post by Easter »

I am still chasing my tail with this!! Hooked up the full size battery from the orange bike (12.75V resting, but able to spin the starter on Dragon Wing easily) had less umph when hooked to the project bike than does the little red battery (13.75V resting). Removed all the spark plugs and it will spin normally. As soon as I put one plug in it starts slowing down. Gave up completely on the cute little Suzuki solenoid, it would just click with the larger battery, so went back to the old solenoid.

I am set up to recheck ignition timing, will try to get to that this afternoon but it seems to me while timing would affect starting, it should not affect compression? I might try checking actual compression as well if i can keep the battery going long enough to get to all the cylinders.
Bikes at present:

83 XL 600r with a 2004 XR650L engine
And a slightly worse for the wear BMW GS adventure bike awaiting repair
83 GL in process :IDTS:
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desertrefugee
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#69

Post by desertrefugee »

Just to confirm, in post #62, Track T suggested jumpering directly onto the starter from a battery. You seemed to indicate that, when doing this, it spun over nicely. If so, that eliminates grounding as an issue. There must be some loss coming off the positive battery terminal, through the solenoid and over to the starter. What else could it be if it spins over well "hot wiring" it?

So, it would be the solenoid or the fat wiring connections between it and the battery or it and the starter.

Or the starter is just rotten.
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#70

Post by ericheath »

Any chance you have the double marked pulleys and inadvertently used the wrong marks? That would advance your cams to a dangerously close position. It would bump the compression up.
IMG_1915.PNG
IMG_1915.PNG (757.49 KiB) Viewed 217 times
Last edited by ericheath on Sat Jul 29, 2017 8:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
Whatever I suggest here should be given ample time for a moderator to delicately correct. I apologize in advance.
77 WING, 1200 engine with 77 heads, cams, gl1100 foot pegs, Magna V65 front end, 764A carbs, [-gone Suzuki M109 monoshock--, replaced with gl1100 shocks] gl 1200 swing arm, gl1500 final drive, wheel and rear brakes Valkyrie seat, Meanstreak tank, Sportster pipes, Power Arc ignition off crank.
77 Wing. black
83 Wing, in pieces
"Continuing education is important even if the subject matter is fairly useless (as in this case)."---Greg Foresi
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Easter
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#71

Post by Easter »

desertrefugee wrote:Just to confirm, in post #62, Track T suggested jumpering directly onto the starter from a battery. You seemed to indicate that, when doing this, it spun over nicely. If so, that eliminates grounding as an issue. There must be some loss coming off the positive battery terminal, through the solenoid and over to the starter. What else could it be if it spins over well "hot wiring" it?

So, it would be the solenoid or the fat wiring connections between it and the battery or it and the starter.

Or the starter is just rotten.
One of the joys of working on these old bikes is substituting parts from unknown sources or donor bikes that you know nothing about. Turns out the starter was bad or should I say three of my four starters were bad plus the battery was weak, and somewhere along the way I cooked both of the solenoids. This morning, now that I know the battery has what it takes, with the battery out of the bike, I wired it directly to the starter and shorted the ground to the frame. Results: same slow spin as before. So then I switched to another starter and presto it spins like it should (I am pretty sure I tested this starter before as it has new paint). Hooked everything back up through the old GL1000 solenoid --nothing. Then switched back to the new Suzuki solenoid --click click. Then the screwdriver trick --engine spins over like it should. So I definitely I need a solenoid. Then tried to actually start it by shorting the solenoid. Turns over but nothing else happens. Curious, as it has actually fired up briefly a time or two. Checked the fuel, maybe I need to be on reserve--still nothing. Pulled the fuel line to the carb --no fuel. hooked up my auxiliary fuel bottle and primed the carbs. STARTED RIGHT UP AND SOUNDS GREAT --for the minute or two I let it run dancr .

Fortunately I have about six or eight fuel pumps so I should be able to find one that works. I picked one at random, cleaned it up and gave it a coat of paint, and will install it later today. Have to order a solenoid.

Anyway now I can move on to the paint. Correct stainless brake lines are on order so we are getting close now.
Bikes at present:

83 XL 600r with a 2004 XR650L engine
And a slightly worse for the wear BMW GS adventure bike awaiting repair
83 GL in process :IDTS:
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Easter
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#72

Post by Easter »

Eric, I made that mistake once before on another bike (black beauty) Hopefully will not make the same mistake again. I did tinker with the electronic timing and checked the compression. I think I got the timing a bit closer and we won't talk about compression until I have run it a bit but lets just say it wasn't too high.
Bikes at present:

83 XL 600r with a 2004 XR650L engine
And a slightly worse for the wear BMW GS adventure bike awaiting repair
83 GL in process :IDTS:
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ericheath
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#73

Post by ericheath »

Anyone with those marks should grind or file them off. Glad you have your issue sorted out.
Whatever I suggest here should be given ample time for a moderator to delicately correct. I apologize in advance.
77 WING, 1200 engine with 77 heads, cams, gl1100 foot pegs, Magna V65 front end, 764A carbs, [-gone Suzuki M109 monoshock--, replaced with gl1100 shocks] gl 1200 swing arm, gl1500 final drive, wheel and rear brakes Valkyrie seat, Meanstreak tank, Sportster pipes, Power Arc ignition off crank.
77 Wing. black
83 Wing, in pieces
"Continuing education is important even if the subject matter is fairly useless (as in this case)."---Greg Foresi
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#74

Post by Goboy »

So just to confirm the proper mark to use which is the right one? I don't recall any confusion when I did my belts, but two marks would have.
Timing marks.JPG
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Previous bikes: 05 Yamaha FJR 1300, 79 Suzuki GS 1000, 75 Yamaha XS 650, 73 Kawasaki S2 350
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Re: Out of the Dumpster

#75

Post by ericheath »

The one with the arrow. Will edit pic
Whatever I suggest here should be given ample time for a moderator to delicately correct. I apologize in advance.
77 WING, 1200 engine with 77 heads, cams, gl1100 foot pegs, Magna V65 front end, 764A carbs, [-gone Suzuki M109 monoshock--, replaced with gl1100 shocks] gl 1200 swing arm, gl1500 final drive, wheel and rear brakes Valkyrie seat, Meanstreak tank, Sportster pipes, Power Arc ignition off crank.
77 Wing. black
83 Wing, in pieces
"Continuing education is important even if the subject matter is fairly useless (as in this case)."---Greg Foresi
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