Starter Rebuild Question

[Dr. Frankenstein]

So I dove into my starter rebuild this afternoon, but was brought up short by this:
DSCN2435 by Dr. Frankenstein1, on Flickr
No matter how carefully I tried to bend those soldering points, they won't - bend, that is. I was going to take out the commutator (the round thing inside), but it will not go past those points.

A straight-down shot - notice how it forms a kind of rough square around the 'shoulders' of the commutator...?
DSCN2433 by Dr. Frankenstein1, on Flickr

Then I found these rebuild instructions on the forum:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=61378&p=800608&hili ... ld#p800608

These instructions say to just leave it inside and spray it down really well with electronic cleaner, which is probably what I will do. As far as those tabs on the plate - does it really help to bend them in a bit? has anybody done it with these instructions, and what was the outcome?

Also, what kind of grease to use on the reduction gears?? Moly paste, or just regular 'ol moly-infused grease?

[gltriker]

whoa! Although I've never disassembled one of these Engine starter motors, what happened to the center shaft of the armature assembly?
Looks like it has moved. As I recall, on any armature assembly I'd ever seen, the center shaft's shoulder should be flush with the outer end of the insulated copper commutator segments.
Somebody been tapping on the end of that armature shaft?

see this
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=54412

[flyin900]

Can you not remove it from the other end of the motor. Both caps will come off the centre section. I have had a few apart and never an issue in getting the centre commutator out. It’s been a few years and I don’t know all the tricks anymore.

[ritalz]

I've had to carefully bend those connections just enough to allow it to slide out. If the connection breaks you have to silver solder it back together. Haven't had much luck with doing that. Cleaning the copper and replacing the brushes can be done without more disassembly.

[pidjones]

If it won't come out the other end, just polish (nothing courser than ~600 grit) up to at least 2000 grit, flush liberally with isopropyl to get any grit out - maybe use a toothbrush to vlean the commutator gaps. Lubricate the planetary with lithium grease.

[Dr. Frankenstein]

Cliff - No, I haven't been doing anything other than taking it apart; no tapping or otherwise beating on it. Electrical parts don't respond well to beatings. (Although I have been sorely tempted many times).

Flyin' - Yeah, I tried that; I got the end-cap off, but it looks like the other end is sealed, like a can.

Ritalz - "Cleaning the copper and replacing the brushes can be done without more disassembly." That's probably what I'm going to do; given the dubious state of the crank, I'll just do what I can to clean it up and put it back in and see if it works. The brushes measure out to about 6 or 7 mm, so they should be good, at least for my purposes. Although as far as the rusty crank, like I mentioned it's not that bad - that rusty spot is the only spot that's rusty, and THAT is only about an inch and a half long. Jeez, if I'd let rust scare me off of bikes I never would have started this addiction...

Jonesy: That's probably what I will do. Re: the grease - lithium or moly? I have a jar of almost pure moly I use for wheel splines - doesn't take much! Or is that too heavy?

[pidjones]

Lithium. This is not a fairly static high-pressure situation.

[Dr. Frankenstein]

Well, I got the starter rebuilt, and even positioned back in its hole, but what's the secret to getting it to engage the sprocket? The bike is on the center stand, and after a good hour of just trying to get it back in to its hole and lined up with the sprocket, it feels like it needs to be pressed in to make it past the hole's shoulder, let alone making sure it's lined up so it does go back in; what's the secret handshake or code word to make this happen?

I've tried holding my head right, various tongue positions, sweet-talking the bike (they DO listen, you know!), thinking happy thoughts...what am I missing? I thought about putting it onto the side stand, but in the position the bike is in on my lift, the side stand misses the edge...

[CYBORG]

When the starter is removed, and the bike is sitting straight up, the sprocket, and the chain piviot t'ward the center of the engine. The only way I know is the tilt the bike to the left. on the side stand is best, and the sprocket will swing back into position

[CYBORG]

When the starter is rem, and the bike is sitting straight up, the sprocket, and the chain piviot t'ward the center of the engine. The only way I know is the tilt the bike to the left. on the side stand is best, and the sprocket will swing back into position

[ritalz]

It's always easier to line up the shaft to the sprocket with the bike on the side stand. By now, you may have nicked the edge of the splines and it will be tough to get the alignment right. The sprocket can be extracted and test fitted on the shaft easy enough. If the sprocket slides on the shaft with little effort, you are good to proceed. If not you will have to clean up the splines for better fitment. With the bike on the side the sprocket will hang more toward the center of the hole and the shaft can line up much easier. Sometimes you can get lucky and get it to line up while the bike is on the center stand but not often.

[Lucien Harpress]

You should not have to force the shaft onto the sprocket. It may take some wiggling (and maybe sticking your tongue out the other side of your mouth instead), but you'll get it.

[flyin900]

Also make sure the area that the starter body slides into in the engine case is nice and clean, as with the same area of the starter snout on either side of the O ring. The O ring will offer a little resistance, as the snout is pushed into the engine case, so a little lube on the O ring can't hurt either.

[Dr. Frankenstein]

"you may have nicked the edge of the splines and it will be tough to get the alignment right. The sprocket can be extracted and test fitted on the shaft easy enough. If the sprocket slides on the shaft with little effort, you are good to proceed. If not you will have to clean up the splines for better fitment"

It looks like that was exactly what happened; I took out the sprocket and tried to put it on the shaft to test-fit it, see if it was snagging, and it was a pretty tight fit. I cleaned up the grooves a bit to where I could put it on and pull it off by hand, put the sprocket back in the chain (a bit sweat-inducing as I could see it in my mind's eye rolling off or something and dropping down into the engine), lined it up and the starter literally just popped back in! (it IS in, isn't it?? ) And Yes, I did it with the bike on the center stand, too!

I haven't tried it yet, I ran out of daylight, and I had to attend to Barbara, but at least it's one more thing out of the way.

[ritalz]

Glad I could help.