'80 1100 Imvubu Build

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wheeliedog
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#511

Post by wheeliedog »

Norbert R wrote:Hope you had a wheelie wheelie good holiday :P
Now get back in the garage and get that sweet ride sorted so we can go for a run anim-cheers1
Thanks, I did, but the holiday also flew by wheelie wheelie quickly ;)

Been back for a week and a half already and just had to hit the ground running, pretty hectic at work and home with the start of the new year. A new routine too, with my middle daughter joining my son at high school, where is the time going?!!!!

Imvubu is still in the critical care unit and I still need to sort out her valve cover oil leaks. My biggest concern though is the total bog down under acceleration, hopefully I can spend some time this weekend identifying the cause. Ericheath mentioned the vacuum advance but I don't think it's that. I made sure to clean and test the unit when I I was busy with the rebuild and I also fitted a new vacuum hose. A timing advance failure would certainly cause poor acceleration, or at least a hesitation, but I have absolutely no power over 4000 rpm. I still need to sync the carbs so I can't rule that out yet. However I think my bench sync was pretty close and she certainly starts and runs at lower revs very sweetly.

I first want to double check my work on the motor. Valve timing, plugs, valve clearances, run a compression test,etc, etc this weekend just to rule out the basics. Although the ignition is electronic I think I might also need to check the spark timing. Wish me luck :roll:
naked 1980 GL1100 under construction.
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wheeliedog
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#512

Post by wheeliedog »

Just like our president jacob zuma (small letters no accident) and Nero, the Emperor of Rome in it's more glorious days, I too have been fiddling when all else around me is turning to ash.

Four months ago I ordered a chrome headlight cover that went missing in the post. Returning from holiday there was a collection slip for it!

I immediately fiddled with my headlight getting it fitted. I love the looks, I think it goes nicely with the chrome headlight ring.
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robin1731
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#513

Post by robin1731 »

Carb sync doesn't have much affect at higher rpm. It could be timing advance. Could also be running rich. What do the plugs look like?

Another other cause could be plugged air or fuel filter. Float height. Choke not coming completely off on one or more carb.

.
1976 Goldwing Super Sport
1985 Honda Elite
1976 KZ900 Dragbike
1992 ZX7 Dragbike (KZ900 style motor w/NOS)
and a rotation of various purchases
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wheeliedog
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#514

Post by wheeliedog »

Agreed, I don't think that if the carbs are out of sync it would explain the severity of my problem, but it does still need to be done though. To my mind it's also too severe to be the timing advance.

I have not checked plugs or anything else yet for clues. I last rode her two days before we went on holiday in December and I haven't touched her since, bar the fitment of the chrome headlight cover. I don't want to chase my tail so I am first going to double check if I did something wrong mechanically, even if it's just to put my mind at ease. Air filter is new as is the fuel filter, but I did have a recurrence of rust in the tank so it might be contaminated, although unlikely because I derusted the tank again before running any fuel through it, fuel tap was off at all times on the bike, so I should not have had a flow of contaminated fuel through to the filter and carbs, but then it does feel like a fuel starvation problem. Sorry, I'm rambling a bit, just thinking out loud :mrgreen:

I really hope that it's a simple fix, I took my time on the carb rebuild and did everything as thoroughly as possible. I can't think of anything that I might have missed....

I'll check voltages at the battery and coils too, I vaguely remember reading here somewhere about a possible issue.

Watch this space, lots of questions to follow ;)
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BikeMaine
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#515

Post by BikeMaine »

wheeliedog wrote:Just like our president jacob zuma (small letters no accident) and Nero, the Emperor of Rome in it's more glorious days, I too have been fiddling when all else around me is turning to ash.

Four months ago I ordered a chrome headlight cover that went missing in the post. Returning from holiday there was a collection slip for it!

I immediately fiddled with my headlight getting it fitted. I love the looks, I think it goes nicely with the chrome headlight ring.
I really like that steel mesh over the headlight. action1
Kevin
1982 GL1100A
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robin1731
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#516

Post by robin1731 »

Did you clean the fuel pump diaphragm? If not dirt/crud could still be getting to the newly rebuilt carbs.

.
1976 Goldwing Super Sport
1985 Honda Elite
1976 KZ900 Dragbike
1992 ZX7 Dragbike (KZ900 style motor w/NOS)
and a rotation of various purchases
Randakk approved Carb Rebuilder
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wheeliedog
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#517

Post by wheeliedog »

Right, I spent most of my weekend on Imvubu trying to figure out the reason for her complete lack of performance under throttle. She bogs down completely and the exhaust note turns into a cacophony of misses, pops, and hesitations.

Because I bought her as a non runner and have no history on the bike I felt it was prudent to test every component that plays a role in the run cycle. I also thought it was important to double check the work that I have done too, considering my skill set, and the constant interruptions my spanner time is subject to, I could quite easily have fluffed something....

First I removed the plugs. They indicate that the bike is running too rich, but I regard this as only a clue to my air screw settings that might be slightly off and are still set to 1 & a 1/4 turns out as per my Haynes manual. I have not adjusted them as I consider this to be more of a fine tuning at idle and lower revs than a critical factor in explaining my problem at higher rpm's.

Next up I did a compression test. Lowest reading was 140 on no 1 cylinder and the rest were all at 145. This is a huge improvement on when I first got the bike where 1 & 3 read below 120, and 2 & 4 were at 140. I did a rough calculation for altitude compensation and I am pretty spot on to factory spec of 171 psi.

Next step was to check valve clearances. This was subject to a serious delay because I couldn't find my feeler gauge anywhere and had to go and buy a replacement :roll: I removed the valve covers and found TDC on the flywheel. I confirmed that piston no 1 was at TDC by feeling for the top of the cylinder with a screwdriver through the plug hole. I also removed the front RHS timing belt cover to confirm the cam timing marks are aligned. I took a shortcut here and left the LHS cover in place because the inner bolt is so hard to get to, and I recall being completely satisfied with the alignment when I originally did it. Everything checks out.

Then I discovered a problem on the valve clearances!
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ericheath
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#518

Post by ericheath »

I'm thinking, "You're going to tell us right?"
Whatever I suggest here should be given ample time for a moderator to delicately correct. I apologize in advance.
77 WING, 1200 engine with 77 heads, cams, gl1100 foot pegs, Magna V65 front end, 764A carbs, [-gone Suzuki M109 monoshock--, replaced with gl1100 shocks] gl 1200 swing arm, gl1500 final drive, wheel and rear brakes Valkyrie seat, Meanstreak tank, Sportster pipes, Power Arc ignition off crank.
77 Wing. black
83 Wing, in pieces
"Continuing education is important even if the subject matter is fairly useless (as in this case)."---Greg Foresi
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wheeliedog
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#519

Post by wheeliedog »

Yes, I managed to catch a fluff. The exhaust valve clearance adjuster for no 3 cylinder had turned loose and dropped out. I found it lying against the bottom lip!

Just as well I thought it so important to check the work I've done.....

So now I thought I had found the cause of my poor running, a valve that was barely opening :-D

I put the covers back on, confidently started her up and went for a test run. Still no better!!!!!

Back into the garage to continue the hunt. I thought it important to do a carb sync at this stage, just to see if they were possibly really so far out from each other that I was maybe powering along from the one lead cylinder only. I made up a simple balancer system from some clear tubing and garden irrigation fittings that screw into the vacuum ports on the intakes.

Although some adjustment was necessary I found them to be pretty close, all I needed was a half turn on the adjuster screws at most.
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wheeliedog
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#520

Post by wheeliedog »

I apologize for my long posts but I want to cover everything I did so that you guys can point out the holes in my diagnostic process.

I shifted my attention to spark timing after another test run showed no improvement. First I removed the vacuum pipe and rode her again. No improvement, so I thought this must finally be it. I couldn't feel any vacuum at the carb with my fingertip blocking the port so back into the garage I went and put on my thinking cap. I have a large syringe that I use for bleeding jobs and with some tubing connected it to the carb vacuum port. Lo and behold as I opened the throttle the plunger moved down in the syringe.

Next I attached the syringe to the vacuum advance unit. When pulling on the plunger to create vacuum the revs increased, pushing the plunger back in would cause the revs to fall. I was pretty certain now that my advance unit was working but I went further to confirm my conclusion. I removed my RHS timing belt cover (again!) and highlighted the cam pulley marking with correction fluid. I dug out my timing light and first confirmed that I was getting spark at all the cylinders by hooking each one up individually. Timing light went from flashing to solid on as I opened the throttle. Then I checked spark timing on my no 1 cylinder against the cam pulley marking and saw the marks lined up very closely, firing around TDC at idle. Opening and closing the throttle advanced and slowed the timing mark. I didn't measure the angle of the advance, I was satisfied that it seems to be working, and being non adjustable on the 1100 I think I can leave it alone?

So having checked everything I could think of I could only conclude that my problem lies with the carbs. I ended my weekend by removing them from the bike ready for a tear down. I wonder what fluffy I will find when I get time to open them up. Maybe my missing feeler gauge?

The frustrating thing is that my symptoms only occur under load. Gently opening the throttle in first gear I can manage maybe 6000 rpm smoothly. Second gear around 3000 and third\fourth gear only 2000 rpm. In the garage she revs freely.

If you are in agreement with my diagnosis I will post any carb related queries in the technical section when I get time to get stuck into them. Please, if you guys can think of anything else I should have checked or should have tested more thoroughly let me know.

Oh yes, I checked charging voltage at the battery and got 14.4v. I assume if the charging voltage is correct I don't need to check anything further eg at the coils, etc? I also confirmed that the fuel pump is pushing out fuel with the pipe going to the carbs disconnected and hitting the starter. It's certainly pumping enough to keep the bike running.

So she stands with her lungs removed....
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wheeliedog
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#521

Post by wheeliedog »

I think I should copy these last posts to a dedicated thread in the Technical section anyway. I think any replies are better posted there for future reference for anyone else to use, instead of getting lost amongst all the pages of waffle here.

Thanks in advance.....
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BikeMaine
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#522

Post by BikeMaine »

Dang, I wish I had the knowledge to help you man!
Kevin
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wheeliedog
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#523

Post by wheeliedog »

Thanks BikeMaine.

At least you seem to be getting some miles under your belt on your ride anim-cheers1
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#524

Post by sunnbobb »

This is EXACTLY what I had happen with No Quarter.I finally gave up and had Pistol Pete rebuild a set of carbs (different ones) and my problem went away. I never coould figure out what the neck the problem was with those carbs, even after tearing them down twice.
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1978 Learning Experience
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1981 Street Fighter GL1100 "No Quarter"
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Re: '80 1100 Imvubu Build

#525

Post by deathbypizza »

hey wheelie!
just a question about the acewell
i bought a 4xxx just then, with the proper speedo, water temp sensor, etc. im wondering if you could help/guide me on the wiring, as you are using a acewell

thanks!
wiest
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1978 GL1000
"I Have No Idea What I Am Doing."
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